Nobody likes to admit it but the Stones were almost a cult following in the States for the first year and a half before Satisfaction came along and the other thing is....Capitol kept pushing the Beatles aside until the DJs in the States forced their hand to rethink their position in releasing their records and re-releasing earlier records put out by other labels that originally got ignored.  And the only reason the DJs started playing "I Want To Hold Your Hand" was because of a few people who accidently heard it and thought the tune was catchy.  Nobody remembers but Dick Clark actually put out a Beatles record (She Loves You) in the summer of 1963 and debuted it on Bandstand and it flopped amongst the kids.  He even showed their photo and the kids laughed.  So there is a little truth behind Capitol telling the kids that Beatles are cool but you still gotta give some credit to everybody who believed in "I Want To Hold Your Hand" before it got released in America. 

There is truth to that. Many of the great bands of the time couldn't get any better than minimal local air play and school dances for gigs - and all because most of them were too everything that was supposedly so great about The Beatles.

Thane Cesar said:

All I'm saying is that if you have a massive machine like EMI behind you, you will be big. Not to say they didn't have talent, but they had a lot of breaks other bands didn't. Not ever band gets their own Alan Parsons, you know what I mean?

All I'm saying is that if you have a massive machine like EMI behind you, you will be big. Not to say they didn't have talent, but they had a lot of breaks other bands didn't. Not ever band gets their own Alan Parsons, you know what I mean?

Some like the Beatles, some like the Stones, but we all love the Kinks!

I'm a Beatles-in-the-AM/Stones-in-the-PM kinda guy.

Well, thank you for that, Don.

Opinionated? Perhaps. But a better word IMO is passionate and I for one enjoy that. Keep on posting! :)

-Don

I find myself deleting replies because it turns out my wife is right, I am very opinionated. I can't help but think though, that The Beatles rise to fame was much like that of most pop artists before and since. The closest things to "Beatle Mania" in recent history have been New Kids On The Block, The Backstreet Boys, and NSYNC. Today our biggest stars are Carrie Underwood and that horrible tripe called GaGa. I'm not saying The Beatles are on the same level of mediocrity, but there is a pattern here. True, there has not been a Beatle Mania since, well, Beatle Mania, but maybe people just realized how silly they were being.

To write the Beatles's success off as depending on corporate marketing is to not have been there.  Today one cannot imagine the effect their music had on the minds, souls and loins of a teenager back when they first appeared on the airwaves.

I was such a teenager.  Already a working musician. Not into TV at all. Not into hype.  But let me tell you the effect that hearing She Loves You had on me...

I was with my girlfriend in her bedroom. Her parents were out. We were doing the stuff that curious teenagers do at such times.

This girl was a gorgeous blue-eyed Swedish blond.  My attention was not easily distracted.

Suddenly this sound came on the radio. I simply sat up, frozen in time and space, completely and totally mesmerized. I had never heard such a thing. Never been effected like that by any music. Electrified. I at that time had no idea of who the group was.

Today there is no way to simulate that effect. That of something totally fresh and new. Something that entered one's very soul and spirit.

Others may have been effected by other music like that. Perhaps some reacted that way when they first heard Elvis. That I cannot say.  But never to my knowledge has it happened since. And if you grew up with Beatle influenced RnR as the soundtrack of your life you truly cannot even imagine what it was like to hear that music for the first time.

-Don

PS - Lynn - if perchance you are reading this - I really do apologize! :D~

I was brought up on the Stones, so I'd go for them.

I like the Beatles, don't get me wrong, and the Lemmy quote is true. The Beatles in Hamburg!

However I do think the Beatles get a lot more credit for things than they deserve. After all, they had a corporation behind them, so yeah, of course they were going to be big.

The Stones may have been middle class(ish, only really Jagger and Watts), but c'mon, the Beatles were hardly born in a briar patch, were they?

 

The real question is Elvis or Buddy? And I'm a confirm Buddy-ite.

No he wasn't as harsh as that but I'm not putting them down either. I love the attitude in songs like Salt of the Earth and their decadence. And their best music is tough as nails. It's not like they were loaded. I don't think a life of ease and comfort makes for great musicians but the unease and discomfort can come from within as well as without, regardless of background.

Mike Humsgreen said:

Did he ever say it as harsh as that? I know he did kinda say what you said in that film but that sounds a bit of an unfair thing to say about a fellow musician. It's often interesting to hear about a band's background but I often wonder if it really makes any difference to the quality or style of music.

I'm definitely more on the Stones side.

Dana V. Hatch said:

the Stones pampered upper middle class prats.

Apple Corp. Don't let hippies look after the money. I take it everyone has seen All You Need Is Cash?

 

And Buddy was God, in that sense. But everybody knows Willie Dixon is really God.

First off, the Wailers were turning into a pop band who did weddings by 1963 so there best years (up to that point) were behind them, so you can thank the Beatles, then the Sonics for giving them a kick in the butt.  The Leaves?  They used the Byrds as a blue print which of course leads us back to the Beatles.  The Thirteenth Floor Elevators would have never gotten started if their individual members hadn't been turned on by Stones and Kinks records (they all would have been in seperate bands still doing country, older blues and Buddy Holly tunes), which probably wouldn't have made it here if Beatles records hadn't come first.  And of course, Sky Saxon wanted to be bigger than the Stones and again, same as Thirteenth Floor Elevators, no Stones records in the States would have been hits if the Beatles hadn't opened the doors first.  DJs and Record labels didn't care about British records until the fans wanted them.  Fans didn't want them until "I Want to Hold Your Hand" made a big impact.  Even the Beach Boys probably would have been washed up if that record hadn't come along.  C'mon!  Even if the Beatles are gutless, bands that followed wouldn't have had anything to prove if that factor wasn't there. 

RJFait said:

The Fabulous Wailers, The Leaves, The 13th Floor Elevators and The Seeds would have been some heavy shit with or without the Beatles. Would the Beatles have been nearly as heavy without them? I find that very doubtful. The Beatles were a pop band covering American R&B when these bands were creating a genre. Just my 2 cents. Take it for what it's worth.

matthew rosedon said:

Don't mean to upset anyone but I do wonder about the mental state of anyone who claims not to like the Beatles.  Apart from everything else they contributed to making the world a better place, without them I doubt very much whether this site would exist.  THEY CHANGED EVERYTHING.

This thread reminds me of two earlier -- OK, much earlier ones -- when, first, the lovers of the simple (Call it "classical") sounds and melodies rejected the overly ornate, show-offy, sounds of their predecessors only to have their own music quickly rejected by a younger generation as being soulless and overly concerned with form.

I am of course discussing Haydn and his clan's rejection of the baroque and then the romantics rejection of Haydn and those that followed him.

;-)

-don

i THOUGHT OF SOME MORE RAMONES MISINTERPRETATIONS FROM MY YOUTH (I MOSTLY HAD THE PORTUGESE RECORDS AND TAPES THAT HAD NO LYRIC SHETS.), John.

 

Cretin Hop - "WE'RE THE NUMBER ONE RELIGION."

                 "GONNA GO FOR A WHIRL WITH MY CRETIN GIRL" .

 

Glad To See You Go - "Don't want you cause you're a whore."   "......a bore".

oh , oh , I Love Her So- "SO i TOOK HER TO CARNY TOWN" "So I took the car downtown.".

 

Carbona Not Glue "Ran out of Paint and rug spray , too" "Ran out of paint and roach spray , too" . (Dan Clowes used this same gag in the original "Ghost World " COMIC WHEN Enid"Goes Punk" for a day.)

 

What's Your Game "I thought you were the one to be , just like the othergirls , you see".

                           "And all you ever want to be is like the other girls you see" (It's not funny , because it still works.).

 

Commando - First rule is - no lox in Germany.

                   Second rule is - been Nazi bombin'

                   Third  rule is - Don't Go to College

                     Fourth Rule is -  it's not quite knowledge.

 

53rd and 3rd  "Now The cops are after me , but I pretend I'm on TV".      

                   '......BUT , i PROVED THAT i'M NO SISSY".   

 

It's Not My Place (In The  9 TO 5 WORLD) -  "Roger Corman's on a talk show , with Alan Arkbush and Steven King, you know".

"With ALAN ALDA and Steven King..."

 

All is Qiet on The Eastern Front -   'Can't you think ,I'm a movie star."

                                                   "Get your feet , I'm all messed up."

                                               (Can't you think , my movements talk....)

We're a Happy Family "Cokin' down Broad Street " " Gulpin' Down Thorazines"

                                ''Our Christmas Card's a Sin " "No Christmas to send..."  

  Why is it Always This Way?   "Hey , Hey , Hey. What is it on the TV?"   

                                            "Hey , Hey , Hey , why is it always this way?"

                                         "And she swallowed a bottle of formaldehyde".

                                     "Now she's lying in a bottle of formaldehyde".              

Hey Don- I love that 60sgaragebands.com it's a great archival site.

Always, Always is a beautiful song, as is Give Your Love To Me. I'll have to go back later to read up on you and your mates, but seriously, it's nice to have this site available to all.

Don said:

Good idea starting this thread Bazza. I'm just learning my way around this site trying to figure out the best way to introduce myself and say "hi."

I've been playing guitar since the early sixties. Was part of 'the scene' back then but sort of dropped out for a time.  My story, if anyone is interested, was put together by Mike Dugo about a year ago (found here http://www.60sgaragebands.com/abstracts.html and here http://www.60sgaragebands.com/tiltonsmarket.html )  In any case I never stopped playing and writing; I just changed my focus and did it for myself, my family and a few friends.

Recent events with my `60s band The Abstracts (including the recent release of an album -- see here http://store03.prostores.com/servlet/uglythings/the-157/ABSTRACTS--... ) has reawakened me I guess -- made me aware that I am hardly alone in my musical tastes! And it is that, probably more than anything, that brought me here!

I'm looking forward to getting to "know" you folks here.  Thanks for listening. :)

 

I'm Rob in Phoenix, Arizona, US. I started off hardcore and (cough, cough) metal, and worked my way backwards to the 60's punk roots. I've been called a punk rock snob. If a deep rooted dislike of Epitaph Records and FAT Records makes me a snob, then I guess I am. I've been playing guitar and bass for about 30 years and my left hand relaxes in the barre chord shape because I never learned much more. It turns out I'm not the virtuoso I thought I was supposed to be. I've started an internet radio station http://radiofreak-out.com that I play mostly pre '84 punk music on. I thought about playing mostly 60's Garage and Psych but that niche is being pretty well covered. There aren't many 'punk' stations that WON'T play Rancid or Pennywise though. So that's the niche I'm after.

Filler from Minor Threat or Bottled Violence from Minor Threat or every songs from Minor Threat

in Switzerland defenetly THE REVOX and the Dead Shamans...

the Sevens swiss 60's garage band

I haven't been burned, I'm just picky. I expect a little crackle, that's part of the joy of vinyl. But... well, I'm picky.

As The Fall once sang... "Check the record, check the record, check the guy's track record" (er, feedback)... I've never once been burned on eBay, but then again I steer clear of the crooked ones.

RJFait said:

Thanks kopper. I've had mixed luck buying vinyl on ebay so I'm reluctant. 

Thanks kopper. I've had mixed luck buying vinyl on ebay so I'm reluctant. I must have the record around somewhere because after serveral hours of internet research, it turns out it was never on a comp and only on that 7". I did some digging around and found that I have the first Estrus Sampler and a couple other Estrus comps, none of them have anything by The Monarchs. I might have to take a trip to my storage unit.

Yeah, that song was on a 3-song 7" that came out on Estrus Records back in 1995. Not sure what comp it could've been on... maybe one of those Estrus sampler discs? Anyway, there's a copy of it on eBay right now. Click here.