I dig the Beatles... it's as simple as that.

but The Kinks, with their guitar solo on You Really Got Me... that invented garage punk music as we know it.

As a dweller in the moody vein of Garage, I am influenced by The Beatles, Zombies et al.

I like The Beatles from Hamburg up until Magical Mystery Tour (excluding Sgt Pepper minus a song or two)

If the Beatles didn't happen... I dunno what garage music would have been like, I think a great deal of it would have remained Pacific North-West styled.

Paul

All your points regarded and respected, but YOU DON'T CALL ANY BEATLES ON OUR ALL BO DIDDLEY! ;)

Well , you know.....When I was in Jr. High , most kids barely knew The Beatles or The Stones , maybe by name , but , that was usually  it , and we're talking only 7 , 8 years after The Beatles broke up , and The Stones' next to last great album ,  "Some Girls" ("A Bigger Bang" is a motherfucker , tho' I guess most people disagree.) was current. Not much has changed in 35 years.... 

I hear you there!

Also, the Beatles question this is the kind of question that spawns a hydra head basket of arguements and fights on here, haha!

Bal said:

After nearly having a memorabilia overdose every time I go into any tourist shop in London I try my best to avoid their music. I can never visit Liverpool for fear of total overkill of nostalgic nick nacks.

The Beatles are cool to hate (oh, so edgy!),  but they are definitely not rubbish. There are some really solid tracks (devoted fan or not).

But is it Garage Punk? No. 

Could one cover a song and make it so? Most definitely.

the Beatles were and are fantastic....something for every mood.....love Revolver

It's always funny that way with the Beatles, Lemmy said it right that in that documentary that people always think of the Beatles as being the softies and the Stones as being the more ballsy rockers. But the Beatles were the working class scousers and it was the Stones who came from Surrey which is probably one of the most middle class counties in Britain.

That's not to say they didn't change into something else. Paul McCartney has just released Kisses on the Bottom and seems to be considered "national icon" status in Britain which is as rock n roll as the Queen. 

Rock À La Casbah said:

I think that what pisses off people about the beatles most of the time is that 'middle class' pretention into which they evolved with psychedelic experimentations and stuff. It's not about the music in itself. They kind of turned the primitive and spontaneous aspect of rock'n'roll into something more pretentious.  Like Lenon staying in bed with Yoko for a week in order to protest for peace. I mean what the fuck. rock'n'roll has always been ambiguous about what it meant by 'revolution and rebellion' but I don't think it was made to stake that kind of stupid claim.

I just don't like them.  I also am not much of an Elvis fan.  I would say there are probably a few tunes by both of them that get my toe tappin', but I can live without them.  They are both too clean for my taste in rock-n-roll.  Jerry Lee Lewis was much better than Elvis, but his hair wasn't as pretty.

This is me being nice about this subject.

There's such a range of material with The Beatles, lots of innovations and just simple good pop tunes too. It's impossible to dismiss them with a straight face.

I wouldn't obsessive over them, but there's some gems that I love (along with some stinkers I avoid) and I imagine anyone willing to dig through their back catalogue will find something that works for them.

I think that what pisses off people about the beatles most of the time is that 'middle class' pretention into which they evolved with psychedelic experimentations and stuff. It's not about the music in itself. They kind of turned the primitive and spontaneous aspect of rock'n'roll into something more pretentious.  Like Lenon staying in bed with Yoko for a week in order to protest for peace. I mean what the fuck. rock'n'roll has always been ambiguous about what it meant by 'revolution and rebellion' but I don't think it was made to stake that kind of stupid claim.

Well I don't go to any specifically garage punk festivals (not that I don't want to) and was wondering if a similar problem happens with the Beatles at those places ie. there always needs to be a Beatles type band because that's what's cool at the moment.

Having said that though I wonder if the Beatles have a sound specific enough for a band to be playing as a Beatles influenced band rather than just a British invasion influenced band. So ignore the question it's a bit dumb.

melissa scott said:

Hey Mike: What I took away from the Record Detective's reply (and others') to the thread is that even discussing Britpop, or charts, or the Beatles doesn't belong at the GPH. There are plenty of other sites to do just that.

Your point about the in-escape-ability of influence runs right up against the above-mentioned sentiment.

Can you clarify your last paragraph? I don't follow...

After nearly having a memorabilia overdose every time I go into any tourist shop in London I try my best to avoid their music. I can never visit Liverpool for fear of total overkill of nostalgic nick nacks.

Hey Mike: What I took away from the Record Detective's reply (and others') to the thread is that even discussing Britpop, or charts, or the Beatles doesn't belong at the GPH. There are plenty of other sites to do just that.

Your point about the in-escape-ability of influence runs right up against the above-mentioned sentiment.

Can you clarify your last paragraph? I don't follow...

I have to say that cuts both ways as they have inspired some real shit (as have all the big ones) and although the most logical response would be only listen to the good stuff and not the bad it can sometimes be a bit tricky. It seems British popular culture is set on an 8 or 10 year timer where every decade there's a British invasion/ Britpop resurgence and the charts get completly dominated by "Beatles fans".

Like I said it surely can't be too hard just to avoid this stuff and really it isn't well I noticed a weird phenomenon here in Europe a year or 2 ago with this "Irish punk" crap. For about 2 years every little rock festival has some Dropkick Murpheys type band playing songs that I find hard to work out whether they are more insulting to English or Irish people.

To get this back on topic, would this sound similar to garage based festivals with the Beatles? I have to ask as I generally go to more punk/hardcore and general rock fests.

dying slowly said:

conversley the amount of garage bands they inpired must earn them a few brownie points (the knickerbocker for example) also the fact they populerised the concept of poppy groups wrighting there own tunes and also the musical magpie nature of the group means it is near immpossible to not like one beatle song.

I for one will always have a soft spot for them as they where the band that got me into music and inspired nearly everyone one way or another

i think a lot of people here may find the beatles too melodic, also the whole cutsey image could be considerd contrieved and overtly comercial for fans of raw anti commercial RnR. Also some people may consider them unoriginal, al the things they popularised (asian music ,psychedelia ,RnR with pop harmonys etc) had alredy been donethats how they where relevent for nearly 8 years.

conversley the amount of garage bands they inpired must earn them a few brownie points (the knickerbocker for example) also the fact they populerised the concept of poppy groups wrighting there own tunes and also the musical magpie nature of the group means it is near immpossible to not like one beatle song.

I for one will always have a soft spot for them as they where the band that got me into music and inspired nearly everyone one way or another

Hey RD -- no need to apologise at all.

You said: Garage punk and the Beatles don't belong on the same page"

I was making an observation based on what people have been posting on this thread, not a personal opinion statement. I never said it did. I DID say I don't 'hate' the Beatles. Don't care one way or t'other.

But I will defend the right for someone to think so if they choose, even if I don't agree.

Sick and tired of discussions of old masters? Hey as long as being 'un-reasonable' generates some kickass new music, I'm all for it.

cheers, mel

the Record Detective said:

My apologies to melissa scott, but the time for being reasonable is long past. Garage punk and the beatles don't belong on the same page, nor the same chapter. I for one am sick and tired of the hideous putrid drivel. Sure there were moments of brilliances (spelling), but the beatles are long dead. Go to a mccartney or starr show and you can say i've seen a living beatle, but that's not the same. It was John Lennon who said "Why call it rock and roll? When you could call it chuck berry?" (paraphrase) (sorry)

My apologies to melissa scott, but the time for being reasonable is long past. Garage punk and the beatles don't belong on the same page, nor the same chapter. I for one am sick and tired of the hideous putrid drivel. Sure there were moments of brilliances (spelling), but the beatles are long dead. Go to a mccartney or starr show and you can say i've seen a living beatle, but that's not the same. It was John Lennon who said "Why call it rock and roll? When you could call it chuck berry?" (paraphrase) (sorry)

True, most of the Hideout members aren't classic rock listeners -- the vibe I get from this discussion thread is that the Beatles don't easily fit one category -- makes 'em problematic.

Actually, I can't think of the last time I heard an early Beatles tune on an FM station except the alt radio station here in Adelaide.

As far as laying waste to classic rock, I never got the sense that was the purpose of the site or its creator, kopper. I'd like to think it's a big happy Hideout, ya know?

That said, any suggestions for slaying the behemoth?

the Record Detective said:

I thought the purpose of this site was to lay waste to classic rock and the FM narrowcasting.

I thought the purpose of this site was to lay waste to classic rock and the FM narrowcasting.

They look just like a garage punk band here. Sure later they became superstars a little later isn't that everybody's dream? Don't hate just cause they were successful. 

Ahhh, that green-eyed monster that haunts a musician's soul from time to time? Success, she's a bloody bitch temptress ain't she? I've seen bands implode on the verge of success due to jealousy. Yuh, DURMmmmm. But, as Sam Sinister said on a different thread, most of the bands that people quote as germinal, big icons like The Clash, were all trying to make it BIG. Some are considered 'cool' but missed out on the REALLY BIG SHOOO.

Music, if you play it or are a listener, is always personal. A song or lp might evoke a lover, a period of time, an idea the is held near and dear. I used to be like, diss my song and make me mad. Music is tribal too -- so my friends and me, we like X. And you don't.

There's all sorts of rubbish I listen to now that I wouldn't 10 years ago. I'm listening for different things than I used to. Put on a record you loved 20 years ago and you may just learn something new -- Like, damn, I never heard the bass line like that before -- even though I now think the song itself is unoriginal and boring.

What's cool about the Hideout is that we ALL have the same basic obsession in common -- garage/punk, the raw stuff. :-) Ain't it the best? *smirk*

Mardy Pune said:

Some good points there Mel. I have to wonder sometimes if the hate isn't purely based around the success the band has enjoyed.

melissa scott said:

Hey Mardy Pune: love your turn of phrase here; "... some of their chord structures are beautiful nightmares to try to play." Kewl.

"Hate stuff for the sake of hating stuff"? I think some people who are saying "I hate x" do have their reasons -- but maybe aren't providing enough of them to those of us reading their posts?

Or, it may be fun to just hate the old stuff to piss other people off. The Beatles and the other 'biggies,' perhaps what you might call 'foundational' groups are Big Targets?

Or some people just like to stiiiiiir. :-) I can relate to the last one when I think back a bit...

Mel

Mardy Pune said:

Let's clear this up now:

Elvis isn't God, Elvis is the King baby!

I don't like The Beatles and I don't hate The Beatles. I won't argue that they weren't an important or influential band, cause they were. They were incredibly crafty song writers, some of their chord structures are beautiful nightmares to try to play. I don't understand why people hate stuff for the sake of hating stuff, morons.

Some good points there Mel. I have to wonder sometimes if the hate isn't purely based around the success the band has enjoyed.

melissa scott said:

Hey Mardy Pune: love your turn of phrase here; "... some of their chord structures are beautiful nightmares to try to play." Kewl.

"Hate stuff for the sake of hating stuff"? I think some people who are saying "I hate x" do have their reasons -- but maybe aren't providing enough of them to those of us reading their posts?

Or, it may be fun to just hate the old stuff to piss other people off. The Beatles and the other 'biggies,' perhaps what you might call 'foundational' groups are Big Targets?

Or some people just like to stiiiiiir. :-) I can relate to the last one when I think back a bit...

Mel

Mardy Pune said:

Let's clear this up now:

Elvis isn't God, Elvis is the King baby!

I don't like The Beatles and I don't hate The Beatles. I won't argue that they weren't an important or influential band, cause they were. They were incredibly crafty song writers, some of their chord structures are beautiful nightmares to try to play. I don't understand why people hate stuff for the sake of hating stuff, morons.

awww damn, never saw there discography... you might be right.

hicksville hogwash said:

Leiber & Stoller are in fact the best song writing pair ever.  http://www.leiberstoller.com/Discography.html as one can see even The "black bad boy" Beatles, Mr. "Pass me the pills Doc" Presley...  most of the gods on this thread did versions of their songs.

True the Beatles are easy targets i don't hate them, the older I get the more easy I am on them. .....

 

they wrote helter skelter. its a sin to dislike.

HELTER SKELTER

Byrds are still better tho.

Leiber & Stoller are in fact the best song writing pair ever.  http://www.leiberstoller.com/Discography.html as one can see even The "black bad boy" Beatles, Mr. "Pass me the pills Doc" Presley...  most of the gods on this thread did versions of their songs.

True the Beatles are easy targets i don't hate them, the older I get the more easy I am on them. .....