Whatever mood Rachel is in, you can always count on Mary to give it her all. Sometimes Rachel just looks bored.

whatwave dave said:

That would be Mary, she used to be in The Verical Pillows, a band that Rob Tyner was working with before he passed away.The Vertical Pillow released at least one 7" and were on a coupla Detroit comps...a pretty cool all female band.



Rockin Rod Strychnine said:

Totally a hit and miss band. I love the style and song choices but sometimes they put on a dud show, except the rhythm guitarist, whatever her name is. She rocks.

That would be Mary, she used to be in The Verical Pillows, a band that Rob Tyner was working with before he passed away.The Vertical Pillow released at least one 7" and were on a coupla Detroit comps...a pretty cool all female band.

Rockin Rod Strychnine said:

Totally a hit and miss band. I love the style and song choices but sometimes they put on a dud show, except the rhythm guitarist, whatever her name is. She rocks.

Totally a hit and miss band. I love the style and song choices but sometimes they put on a dud show, except the rhythm guitarist, whatever her name is. She rocks.

Hahaha that is my skinny, little arm and balding head on the front,right side.

kopper said:

Found some great photos of the fest on this blog: http://ivyleah.blogspot.com/

Below is a photo of St. Louisan Todd Walk crowd-surfing in his wheelchair during the Oblivians' set. I'll try to invite Ivy (the photographer) to join the Hideout. Here's my favorite, though (you can see me in the lower-right, looking up at Todd in his wheelchair):

Check the blog for more great photos: http://ivyleah.blogspot.com/

Found some great photos of the fest on this blog: http://ivyleah.blogspot.com/ Below is a photo of St. Louisan Todd Walk crowd-surfing in his wheelchair during the Oblivians' set. I'll try to invite Ivy (the photographer) to join the Hideout. Here's my favorite, though (you can see me in the lower-right, looking up at Todd in his wheelchair):

I can't really get into something that's been purposely done lo-fi. That seems kind of contrived. But I do like happy accidents, and miss the sound of some of those old 70's early albums by certains artists that must have been recorded on a really tight budget in not the best studios under God knows what conditions. There are sounds on those records that will never be created again in a commercial studio. Records I'm thinking of in particular of course Iggy's Raw Power , also Blue Oyster Cult's debut, early Kiss, especially Hotter Than Hell is one cool mess with an unrivaled trash can drum sound.

It really depends from one act to another, I personally love low-fi recordings. We used to record to computers (ugh) and then recently, at the beginning of this year, we got our grubby little paws on a second hand Open Reel 16 track tape machine and matching desk. The difference between the two is a whole universe! With Computers we had bleed, awful sound and a general "dead" feeling to the recordings. Now we record live, in one room and it sounds great, we barely get any bleed from one track to another on our machine and the quality, to me, is better than any studio here could offer (South Africa only has digital studios and they are all stuck on pro tools). Some of my favorite records are dirty, noisy and low-fi and because there's so much over-produced crap floating around I tend to love them even more!

It seems like there's a big misunderstanding what can be considered lo-fi and sounding like you recorded into an answering machine.

I'm sorry, maybe I wasn't clear... I do agree with what you're saying... I mean, if a band sounds just as lo-fi live as they do on their records, I think that's fine... but otherwise it's a problem...

Rockin Rod Strychnine said:

I don't think that's true either. I loved seeing the Brentwoods at Budget Rock but couldn't bring myself to buy any of their records. They do NOT bring out the true sound of the band. I think there's a big difference between lo-fi and NO-fi. Becoming one big sound of mush is just crappy. I don't understand why bands wouldn't rather sound like the Shitsville 45 than Party at Steve's House.
The Foreign Characters said:

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Lo-fi or not is really a question of taste, and I think we've got to respect the vision a band has of their own project. If you don't like a band because their records are lo-fi you'd probably won't like them live anyway, so just don't listen to them.

But I agree with the original post that it's a shame when you listen to a band that sounds great live and then the record sounds bad (whether it is on purpose or not). I guess in that case the band should just decide if they want to be lo-fi or not and be consistent :)

I don't think that's true either. I loved seeing the Brentwoods at Budget Rock but couldn't bring myself to buy any of their records. They do NOT bring out the true sound of the band. I think there's a big difference between lo-fi and NO-fi. Becoming one big sound of mush is just crappy. I don't understand why bands wouldn't rather sound like the Shitsville 45 than Party at Steve's House. The Foreign Characters said:

.

Lo-fi or not is really a question of taste, and I think we've got to respect the vision a band has of their own project. If you don't like a band because their records are lo-fi you'd probably won't like them live anyway, so just don't listen to them.

But I agree with the original post that it's a shame when you listen to a band that sounds great live and then the record sounds bad (whether it is on purpose or not). I guess in that case the band should just decide if they want to be lo-fi or not and be consistent :)

Personally, I don't see why a few over modulated things can't get commercial play. "Have Love Will Travel" made it into a truck commercial but it's the Sonics, so I guess they'll let that one slide. And that seems to be a bit of BS that lo-fi things can't be played on a Little Steven's Show. He's personally played the Mummies "You Must Fight to Live (on the Planet of the Apes for national radio to hear on his Halloween shows. and waht about some 50s stuff like Gary US Bonds? They sound like they were recorded down in the sewers. I use to think, when I was a kid, that those were live concerts, especially "Quarter to Three". I can understand why no one would touch Supercharger or The Brentwoods but The Milkshakes? Their stuff is pretty good sounding for a group who wants to sound like 1963 NOT recorded at Abbey Road or Olympic Sound.

John Carlucci said:

I used to think that wtiting music for commercials was a total sellout. Then I heard "Search & Destroy" used to sell sneakers.That shot that theory to hell. In my own case, the commercial deal fell in our lap 30 years after the band broke up. So it was not created with that as a goal. However, because we recorded at the highest quality available, these things have come our way.

I agree with you regarding the fact that it's getting harder to make a living off of music. It was hard enough 20 years ago when I had a major label deal with RCA. That's why I have another career in which I make my money. This way I can play the type of music I love without ever having to worry about making it commercial. Still, I want whatever I do to sound as good as possible.

I'm not just talking about local bands either. I've seen a few national acts even bands coming over from Europe that play really well & draw good sized crowds at the best clubs in town. I bought their CD's from their merch tables, & found them unlistenable. I personally know a few DJ's from Little Steven's Underground Garage radio. I've given them CD's of some hot local bands. They can not play these lo-fi CD's on the air. A little airplay on a station like that can really help a band survive.

I went to Art School. I studied Photography. I remember a kid in my class came to school with a crappy camera. Our professor told him that he should think of the camera as the tool of the trade & that a craftsman is only as good as the tools he is using will allow him to be. It's the same with music. If you use crappy gear and record as cheaply as possible, it's going to sound cheap & crappy.

Till this day I hear people complaing about the mix on Johnny Thunder's Heartbreakers LP LAMF. I remember them in the very early days as a much better live band than that record captured. They're gone, the record is all that's left. It's not as good as it could have been. You see where I'm coming from here?

Interesting discussion!

I agree with Matt. What I appreciate in a recording is that it closely conveys the live sound of a band. I know, not all recordings are done with this intent, but I feel that in garage/rock'n'roll/punk this is very important. There are bands that I almost never listen to on records because their recordings feel flat as compared to what I saw live. It's very hard to capture what makes a live band special on a recording, and the recording being lo-fi (or hi-fi) may not be related at all with this...

Lo-fi or not is really a question of taste, and I think we've got to respect the vision a band has of their own project. If you don't like a band because their records are lo-fi you'd probably won't like them live anyway, so just don't listen to them.

But I agree with the original post that it's a shame when you listen to a band that sounds great live and then the record sounds bad (whether it is on purpose or not). I guess in that case the band should just decide if they want to be lo-fi or not and be consistent :)

If you want reach a wider audience, you've got to do it right and make it listenable . But there is a cult of people, including listeners out there that want things to sound bad on purpose. You can't stay small time/lo-fi for this minority if you're looking to go somewhere with your music (if you don't care or want to be a hobbyist or play to a limited audience, that's OK too if that's all you want out of music). My current recording project is in a weird double bind situation with this. I play bass with George Brigman, who is best known for his very lo-fi 1975 album Jungle Rot. This record was not intentionally made to be lo-fi; George was working with what he had at the time, and with almost zero recording knowledge at age 18, and had only been playing guitar for about a year and a half. Our last record, Rags In Skull, was digitally recorded (at home) on a Yamaha MD-8, and mastered at Invisible Sound Studio . It was a huge sonic improvement over anything George did in the past, but some were miffed at the fact that it didn't sound like Jungle Rot. We didn't make a record for people who only wanted Jungle Rot. Your playing, writing, gear, all progresses from the time your 18, to thethe time your in your 40's and 50's. We couldn't make Jungle Rot II if we wanted to, although that's what a lot of people including our manager would rather hear us try to do..

i completely agree with your post especially what you say about Little Steven. Mr. Arena Rock douchebag suddenly fancies himself an expert on garage rock. "No bass, no band" he insists, invalidating the Seeds, the Cramps, Hound Dog Taylor & the Houserockers and countless other worthy bands. Someone asked him "What about the Gories?" and HE'D NEVER HEARD OF THEM. Garage rock expert, my dick. What really frosts my ass is in the 70's all the money gigs went to bands playing Springsteen and Zep type crap while rockabilly, garage, and punk bands played in toilets for spare change. But soon as the big money stopped rolling in for fucks like Little Skeevie and Bob Plant they acted like they were into real rock & roll all along.

Dirty Ugly Records said:

I completely disagree with what you have to say on this John.

1st, if it's "cool and retro" to do lo-fi recordings, it's news to me. Maybe it is, I'm pretty out of the loop on what's cool..except for what I think is cool.

This isn't some new development, people have always been doing this since home recording was an option. If it's bigger now, it's just a healthy reaction towards everything being super slick and shitty. Many people want and need a rawness in their music.

I've been playing lo-fi music and helping other people record it since the mid 90s, and have never met one person who was doing it to be hip or whatever. They were either doing it because they had no money, or they plain liked the sound.

You're talking about bands being popular on the club circuit, but can't get their music played on the radio. Frankly there are a LOT of people out there who don't give a shit about being popular or getting played on the radio. Getting big isn't on their agenda. They are doing what is fun for them, and making the sound they want to make.

You're talking about future income, and generating royalties. This is so meaningless to me. I think most people playing lo-fi music don't care about this crap. Again, they do it because they like it.

Really it's just embarrassing to mention you're getting royalties from being on Jay Leno and commercials, or that you were on a major. To a lot of people into raw and lo-fi music, this leaves us scratching our heads...I don't think you get that these are BAD things to most of us into lo-fi..really lame things we would never want to do. Making money is the last thing most of us care about.

Your advice at the end is kind of insulting. "Don't sell yourself short. If a record is un- listenable why even bother?"
Nobody is doing that. Franklly you're just being a snob, and saying this stuff is un-listenable to YOU.

Also how the hell do you know what will stand the test of time?? And why should people care if it does? Some do, some don't. And you can't predict what people will look back on in 20, 50 or 100 years as being good.

If you don't like it, just don't listen to it. Seriously, you're kind of coming off as a cranky old guy who doesn't like what "the kids" are doing today because it isn't what you were into doing.

Why on earth would anybody care about being on Little Steven's show? There are tons of radio shows that play lo-fi music, just not mainstream ones. Frankly, Little Steven and his DJs can go fuck themselves for all I care. There are plenty of podcasts available right on this site that put on way better shows than him. Again, you look at this from the perspective of every band wanting to get big and make money.

What I hear over and over from your two posts, is that it seems you think there is one right way to do things, YOUR way. And you assume that everybody wants what you wanted. You kind of assume everybody wants a big record deal, to make money, to do this and that. Well almost everything you named is completely meaningless to us.

Anyway you have the right to your opinions, but I just think you're dead wrong on this and looking at it in a really weird way.



I don't tell people they suck for recording in a studio, and I don't really appreciate people telling me I suck for being involved in home recording.

Howdy! Beware The Dangers Of A Ghost Scorpion! updates can be found at http://twitter.com/BEWARETHEDANGER

The first four are a great place to start, but I'd say that #5 and #6 are just as good (if not better) than the first four. They start to branch out into some of the more interesting European and Asian stuff, but keep a really good foothold in the ol' US of A. #5 has ESSENTIAL tracks by the Maggots, Dieter Meier, Hubble Bubble, Shit Dogs, Nubs and the Stalin. After #6 they start to get a little spotty, and they start to cover a lot of ground already covered on other comp series. Here's a few other comps and series really worth your time:

Smash the State 1-3 - A totally legit (ie. non-bootleg) comp series of Canadian KBD stuff. Very killer with great liner notes.
Deep In The Throat of Texas - Another legit comp of Texan KBD stuff.
Total Pop - Swedish KBD and powerpop stuff. But good like finding the LP. There were only 333 made.
Bloodstains - A KILLER series of region specific punk comps. The best ones are (in my opinion) all the USA ones (Texas, California, Midwest), Yugoslavia (No, REALLY), The Scandanavian ones (Finland, Denmark, Norway, Sweden), Europe and both "Bloodstains Across the World".
Where Birdmen Flew - an AMAZING Aussie collection.
Hate Your Neighbours - Cool New Zealand KBD stuff.
England Belongs to Me 1-3 - Great UK stuff that leans more towards the poppier side of KBD. These are GREAT. They're way better than the UK Bloodstains series.

Here's some good non-punk comps that are worth your time, too:
Killed By Glam - Exactly like it sounds. Rare UK glam shit from the 70s. Cool if you like that kinda thing.
Live to Ride, Ride To Live - Neat "New Wave of British Heavy Metal" comp. Most of it sounds like punk or oi with better musicianship and more polish. There's some really catchy shit on there.

An introduction to Mojo Workout could read as follows:

Ah, ok, thanks! So this is only the Kingsize Kollection. I didn't look at this yesterday, for it has a different cover.

Cheers, Doc

According to the Dionysus shop, the bands are all from '64 - '67. http://www.dionysusrecords.com/shop/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=904

Hi y'all,

yesterday I bought a second hand copy of this "It's a Kave-In" compilation on vinyl, and it is pretty cool. But I can't find any info on it except that it's an Australian compilation, published in 1987.

Are these revival bands? Are they from the 60's? Does anyone know more?

Thanks, Doc Sanchez

I believe this didn't come out as an album in the 60s. Just a single. Whatever else is on that album was unreleased until this decade.

Diggin' the download!!! Thanx tons!!

The ones that have held up best for me are The Modern Lovers and Ramones debuts, both are perfect albums, not a false note anywhere. Also still love Saints Eternally Yours, Heartbreakers Live at Max's Kansas City, Cramps songs the Lord Taught Us, Iggy Pop New Values, Buzzcocks Singles Going Steady, Christchild Hard and Dead Boys Young Loud and Snotty.

It would have to be 'Damned Damned Damned' and the first 3 Ramones albums. But then albums weren't really the coin of the realm of the first punk era; singles were where most of the action was.

Oh, there is a Halloween Surfcast. Check episode 12 , hosted by the wonderful best Surfcast podcaster ever : Paul "Sharky Von Gasser" Vandervort .

You may check episode 10 of THE HAUNTED SHACK THEATER too if you dig surf'n'monsters !

All you have to do now is enjoy these spooky coktails from the sea my fiend.
Cheers !!!